Breaking Bad

Discussion in 'The Living Room' started by Agent, Jul 15, 2013.

  1. Agent

    Agent Formerly known as Agent Sideburns LPA Über VIP

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    I think my two most favorite moments from the finale were: Walt telling Skyler that he did it all for himself. Man that was powerful and overwhelming to see him finally admitting. Second, that silent exchange of looks between Walt and Jesse before he gets into the car.... fuck! That broke my heart into a million pieces, esp the way Jesse looked at Walt. *cries*
     
  2. Snail

    Snail LPA Super Member LPA Super Member

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    Last edited: Oct 1, 2013
  3. ZachLP

    ZachLP Soldier since 2000

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    I recently thought about this. In my honest opinion, I think Season 5A was actually the darkest part of the series, not Season 5B. Season 5A had tons of dark moments, and it's when Heisenberg was really showing, he was the king at that point. Season 5B was only the final 8 episodes, and the conclusion to all 8 episodes was basically this. Hank caught on that Walt was 'Heisenberg', but he didn't have concrete evidence to bring to the DEA, so while Walt was covering his tracks and tying up lose ends, Hank tried to collect enough evidence to be able to use. This took 5 and a half episodes. Half way through the 5th episode, things heated up, Hank and Jesse partnered up and got enough evidence by tricking Walt. Jack and his crew showed up and murdered Hank and Gomez, while taking Jesse as prisoner. Walt then fled to New Hampshire, while Skyler and the rest of the family fell apart, dealing with lawyers and having no money, the bank taking the house, etc. The finale was Walt coming back to Albuquerque to put an end to it all; taking out Jack and his crew for killing Hank, while trying to leave his last money for Walter Jr and the family. He originally wasn't going to save Jesse, that wasn't part of the plan, until he saw what they did to Jesse. To me, the ''dark'' ending was really just Hank being murdered and Walt eventually seeking out revenge on his murderer, while accidentally getting shot and dying in the process. As much as I liked the ending, I didn't LOVE it, like I expected to. I guess I expected Walt to become so dark in these final 8 episodes, that many people in the family would be killed, etc, but it was the other way around, it was really Walter White returning to the forefront and eventually ending it all. Meh.
     
  4. Snail

    Snail LPA Super Member LPA Super Member

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    Vince Gilligan reveals alternate endings

    Gilligan gave fans a remarkable look inside his team’s writing process – and the potential endings they tossed out. Fans will want to listen to the podcast in its entirety, but here are some of the rejected ideas:

    1. Walt Goes Rambo
    “Our original version was that Walt would use it somewhat in Rambo fashion,” Gilligan said. “Hand held. But the closer we got to the end we realized how Walt’s cancer would resurface and how sick Walt would be. That felt wrong for Walt to go out brawn over brain, go out like Rambo. Walt on his best day was never Rambo. Very late in the game we came up with mounting it in the trunk and using the garage door motor as a way of sweeping it back and forth and automating the process. Everyone, me included, loved the moments where Walt was MacGyveresque.”
    Also read: ‘Breaking Bad’ Finale: 5 (Sort of) Loose Ends (Video)

    2. Walt Kills Cops
    “We thought, gee, is it too obvious he’d use it on a bunch of bad guys? … He wanted to be known as Jesse James. He wants the credit. So we had versions that we talked about for instance where the police come to get him. He uses it on the police. But we didn’t like that. It just didn’t seem right.”

    3. Walt Takes Out a Jail
    “We had a version where he goes and breaks Jesse out of jail just as the Nazis were gonna knock Jesse off in jail, and he comes in and uses an M60 to lay waste to an entire prison or a prison bus.”
    Gilligan says of the alternate M60 scenarios: “I’m not saying we got far with those, but we would talk them through for hours on end. … We were like, you know what? as bad as Walt is we don’t want to see him killing good guys. If he’s going to use this M60, even if it’s slightly less surprising, let’s see him use it on guys even worse than he is.”
    Also read: Can Bryan Cranston Escape ‘Breaking Bad’s’ Success?

    4. Skyler Kills Herself
    “I was leaning toward that and the other writers were like, that’s a bridge too far. Let’s not do that. And they were right. I think that would have been very unnecessary. … I was thinking at some point she went with the Disappearer. We talked about every option under the sun… and one of them was that Skyler leaves with Walt and the Disappearer. … We could almost kinda sorta see where Skyler would go if she was sort of like zombified. But we could never figure out how to get Jr. to go along. … There’s no bringing Jr. if Jr. doesn’t want to go. We talked about a possible version where Skyler and Walt are tied up at a Motel 6 kind of place and he’s talking to her in a bathroom saying, ‘It’s going to be alright… I’ve got a plan. Skyler? Skyler?’ And he finally forces the door open and she’s in a bloody tub or something like that.”
    Also read: ‘Breaking Bad’s’ Aaron Paul Mashup: The Ultimate Jesse Pinkman ‘Bitch’ Reel (Video)

    5. Jesse Dies, Then Walt Jr. Dies
    This wasn’t necessarily a finale ending, but it was an idea Gilligan kicked around before Season 1 even began. He says he considered a sequence in which a very ruthless drug dealer – he would include elements of Gus Fring, Krazy 8 and Tuco Salamanca – would kill Jesse. Walt, “filled with rage,” shackles him in a basement. He rigs a tripwire with a shotgun, so that the dealer can kill himself by pulling it. Walt wants the dealer to do it, so he begins torturing him from the ground up. He starts at the toes and begins “lopping off bits of this guy and cauterizing it with a blowtorch or something.” This goes on for weeks, but the dealer won’t kill himself. Eventually Walt Jr. discovers him and tries to give him some water. When the dealer realizes Walt Jr. is Walt’s son, he trips the wire and kills them both.
     
  5. ZachLP

    ZachLP Soldier since 2000

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    I think the biggest reason the end of Breaking Bad disappointed me was because Skyler never died. I would have loved that. I wanted it to happen ever since I saw Walt re-arranging the bacon in the intro to Live Free Or Die in Season 5A. The main plot of the final 8 episodes was that Jack and his crew killed Hank and then Walt got revenge against them and died in the end.
     
  6. Jack_Farrell

    Jack_Farrell KTTK is Chester suicide-diving off a cliff naked

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    LOL.
     
  7. Kevin

    Kevin A Pattern To Be Followed. LPA Administrator

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    [thumb]http://www.dailyfailcenter.com/sites/default/files/fail/46b2a37bca1687194ee4541863d2b99c.jpg[/thumb]
     
  8. Jack_Farrell

    Jack_Farrell KTTK is Chester suicide-diving off a cliff naked

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    My eyes, the tears are of laughter and appreciation for this state of the art piece :_)
     
  9. Agent

    Agent Formerly known as Agent Sideburns LPA Über VIP

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    :rofl: Oh Tio!
     
  10. Tim

    Tim My perversion power is accumulating LPA Super Member

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    On the "why didn't Jack's crew check the trunk?" issue, let's not act like this show hasn't been full of a lot of scenarios that are hard to believe. Case in point, two giant chrome-domed Mexican dudes dressed up like Televangelists slaughtering people all over the damn place right in the goddamn open without getting caught. They were straight up cartoon characters murdering anyone they wanted with impunity. It was pure pulp. The series finale was a little too safe for my tastes, but it fit the style of the show and was well executed for what it was.
     
  11. ZachLP

    ZachLP Soldier since 2000

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    It sucks that I loved the show and I really wanted to enjoy the final 8 episodes, but ultimately, it didn't satisfy me. I have seen many fan theories before the final 8 aired that would have satisfied me so much more. I wanted the end to be dark; it wasn't dark, at least in my book. Wow, Hank got shot, we didn't even get to see him get shot (stupid camera angle) or them get buried or anything. We never got to see Gomez DIE. Too many things happened off camera in the final 8. I understand this is on regular cable, but cmon. Jesse got ''beat'' and ''tortured'' but we never saw him get beat and the only thing we saw was them shooting Andrea, which was hard for me to connect to because she was too much of a minor character for me to care about. Also, tons of loose ends were left at the end. What ever happened to Jesse or Brock? What about Saul? Did Gretchen and Elliot ever give the money to Walter Jr? How is the rest of Skyler and the kid's lives? What about Marie? Hank's funeral? Walt's funeral? Wtf. This should have been a 2 hour episode, or at least an hour with no commercial breaks. I don't know. What makes people think it was such an EPIC ending? Seriously, it was WAY too predictable. Jesse got to live because Walt rescued him, the M-60 killed Jack and the gang, the ricin was for Lydia. I predicted that weeks ago and it turned out to be true. It was too corny of an ending. Too happy. Jesse got to live happily ever after, totally unrealistic, because the cops would have been there by the time he drove like 90 MPH out of the compound and broke the gate, he was wanted at that point. Skyler and the kids got the money, at least that was implied. 9 million dollars. Unrealistic. Walt set up a M-60 machine gun in the trunk of his car, and pressed the button on his car keys to open the trunk and somehow it magically shot and killed all of the members through walls and metal bars perfectly, but CONVENIENTLY left Jack and Todd alive, that way Jesse got to kill Todd himself and Walt got to kill Jack himself. Because Walt and Jesse are definitely good guys. This is what I mean when this is a corny happy ending. The whole laser pointer thing with Badger and Pete was highly unbelievable and almost embarrassing. Just this whole episode was full of fail IMO. I wanted to like it, I really did. I tried to make myself like it after watching it. But I just can't like it. Sorry BB fans.
     
  12. Jesse

    Jesse Out of the abyss. LPA Über VIP

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    I think I'm pretty satisfied with everything about season 5 except the finale.

    Things I would have changed.

    I would have had Walt unintentionally save Jesse.
    Have his plan with the "snipers" fail.
    Kept him alive long enough for him to be revived and then taken to jail.

    I just feel that with Gillian's views on Karma that Walt should have suffered more.
    I mean Jesse seems to have suffered MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH more than Walt yet he was the more moral character.
     
  13. travz21

    travz21 Muscle Museum LPA Super Member

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    Except Jesse was a bitch and caused the whole downward spiral, so I don't really care. If he just leaves to Alaska, Hank never gets anywhere with Heisenberg, Hank lives, Andrea lives, Brock has a mom, Neo-Nazis don't steal Walt's money, Walt's family lives a happy life, etc. Even better, if he doesn't go crazy and start chucking millions of dollars out the window he doesn't even have to go to Alaska.

    But for how dark that spiral sounds, it didn't seem that dark. Walt didn't break bad the entire season. It was everyone else breaking bad while Walt did his best to salvage the situation. So, shown from the main character's perspective, it seemed almost uplifting compared to other seasons. His actions were consistent with his character, but I think we all anticipated him to become full-blown Heisenberg by the last few episodes, if not sooner.

    I think that's why it feels like a weird season. It was pretty awesome to see, but it's not the direction most people think his character deserves. Either a happy ending or a dark ending seemed more suited than a redemption arc, especially when a lot of people don't even think he needs redemption.

    Thinking back to Season 1 Heisenberg when he blows up Tuco's office, now that was Walt in his most relentless and ruthless form. Or when he kills those street thugs in Season 3(?). That is him in his fully broken form, taking on a new persona. It seems like he deserved to finish up the series that way. There are so many more interesting ways to take the story when you go that dark and gritty route. That's why the show was so good to begin with, because that was the main focus. Then to take a lighter direction for the last season seemed a little underwhelming regardless of how well the story was told or executed.


    As a side note, Jesse's character really deserved more as well. His character was so shitty the last 8 episodes it tarnishes how great his character was before then. The writers fucked that up big time.


    Edit: I also I wonder what the original story would have been like if Jesse died at the end of Season 1 like was originally planned. I've been wondering that for a few years now.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2013
  14. ZachLP

    ZachLP Soldier since 2000

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    Heisenberg has some badass moments throughout the show. I loved the whole idea of taking an innocent man and turning him into a badass kingpin by the end. Walt blowing up Tuco's headquarters was badass. Walt killing those drug dealers who were using kids was badass. Walt blowing up Gus Fring was badass. Season 5 was different. I say that I thought Season 5A was the darkest that Heisenberg ever got for a few reasons. He shot and killed Mike because of an argument, or disagreement of sorts. That was evil. When he ordered that the inmates were all violently killed in less than 2 minutes, that was evil. Or how about when Todd shot that little kid on the dirtbike to death and Heisenberg didn't care all that much? That is when Walt really started becoming cruel and ruthless, to me, at least, all of those things combined. With the final episodes (Season 5B), I expected Heisenberg to become darker. But he didn't. When Hank confronted him in the garage, he told him to tread lightly, I thought that was the beginning of how dark he really was going to get, but the episodes that followed weren't what I expected. He buried his money in the desert, I understand that. But Walter White returned a few episodes later. He didn't want to kill Jesse, even after Jesse tried to burn his house down, he still didn't want him to be put down. As a matter of fact, he was the only one who tried to save Jesse, actually. Saul and Skyler both wanted him dead. When Walt realized that Jesse was working with Hank, Heisenberg came back, but very shortly. He ordered a hit on Jesse and when he was caught and arrested in the desert and Jack and the crew still came after him saying not to, that was Walter White again, pleading for Hank's life. Once Hank was shot, we really can tell how damaged he has become. Heisenberg came back shortly after when he told Jesse that he watched Jane die, and let them take Jesse as prisoner. Now keep in mind, he didn't know they were going to keep him alive to make meth and torture him, he thought they were going to put him down once they got info from him. Once Walt realized that his family hated him and wouldn't be going on the run with him, he realized for the first time, that he made some bad choices. He snapped back to reality. When he was getting ready to leave for New Hampshire, when him and Saul had that conversation and he started coughing uncontrolably, he realized that his empire was pretty much over. While he spent those months in New Hampshire, his health steadily declined. He made one last effort to try and patch things with his family when he called Walter Jr from that bar. We all know how that conversation went. After that, he finally realized that it was all over, and it wasn't coming back. He returned to Albuquerque to make his final decisions before he died. I believe that he knew he was going to die while heading back to New Hampshire, especially because of what he said in the beginning of Felina. ''Just get me home, I'll do the rest''. Now, some people will argue with me here. I believe that Walter White returned to Albuquerque, not Heisenberg. I believe that Heisenberg died in that bar in New Hampshire. Walt tricking Gretchen and Elliot into taking the money and giving it to Walter Jr was pure genius, that was Walter White using his smarts. Walt once again used his smarts with setting up that meeting with Jack and the crew, and sneakily putting that ricin in Lydia's tea, he outsmarted her and Todd, without them even knowing it. Back at Skyler's new house, the true Walt really showed. He told her that he did this all for him, and that he liked it, he was good at it. For the first time, we see Walt admit it was all for him, truly one of the most powerful scenes in the entire series. He said his last goodbyes to his baby daughter and Skyler, and headed out to finish it all. He outsmarted Jack and the crew by using the M-60 in the trunk idea, and it worked, even though I think it was a tad unrealistic. He saved Jesse in the process, and he told Jesse to kill him, but Jesse wouldn't. This is when Walt has been the most vulnerable in his life. He let Jesse go free, and he went back down to the meth lab, the thing that started it all, and as he looked at the equipment, he fell to the grown and died from a gunshot wound from his own gun.

    Now, while some people say that the final episodes were very dark, I don't think so, really. Walt realized who he really was and how much his 'empire' affected everyone around him negatively. He found himself, it was just way too late, and he knew that, which is why he ended it all the way that he did. Some people may argue that there were a lot of deaths, but not really. Declan, Hank, Gomez, Andrea, Jack, Todd and Lydia were killed off, and the only ones that were 'main characters' were Hank and somewhat Gomez. That's all. I think we all knew that Todd and his crew and Lydia were going to die by the end of the show, when they were introduced. I thought that the 'dark' moments would be Walt turning so bad that it cost his family's lives, etc.
     
  15. Mark

    Mark Canadian Beauty LPA Administrator

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    Can you believe how boring the show would have been if Jesse had simply gone to Alaska? You'd likely be complaining about how Jesse's character simply sauntered off.

    Walt's most ruthless moment was having 9-10 witnesses killed within 2 minutes in prison. Or poisoning a child to manipulate Jesse. Or blowing up a nursing home. Or taping that "confession" to send a threat to his brother-in-law.

    I can't help but laugh at the insinuation the show took the "lighter" route. This entire last half of the season was about how Walt's choices have ruined the lives of everyone around him. Hank is dead, Marie's a widow, Skylar's a suspect and outcast, Jr's emotionally damaged, Holly's never going to get to know her father, Jesse was tortured and saw a girl he loved die for a second time. And this was the lighter route? Everyone's life is in absolute shambles!



    This show is much more than just what happens to Walt, but how his actions negatively affect others, usually unintentionally. Jesse was the quintessential example of this.

    I honestly don't know what they could have done to appease you two, because the grass would have always been greener on the other side.
     
  16. Brandon

    Brandon I was Ree's 100th follower on Twitter.

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    Also, on the topic of consequences, Walt absolutely got what was coming to him. In Ozymandias. I think a lot of people got it in their heads that Walt's karma was going to hit him in the finale, but it came before that.

    And to be honest, the whole Walt and Heisenberg as two different entities sort of wears thin now. They are two sides of the same coin, not two different people. 5A showed just how deep someone can go into darkness, and 5B showed how people can try to rationalize and escape the consequences, in this case to no avail.
     
  17. ZachLP

    ZachLP Soldier since 2000

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    Walt and Heisenberg most definitely are two different people. It's like a split personality. I agree with the rest of your post for the most part, except for that.
     
  18. Jesse

    Jesse Out of the abyss. LPA Über VIP

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    How could you not know what the show could have done when I just explicitly stated what it could have done and you even quoted the post in which I stated it in? And it's not like I didn't like the ending, it was a very good ending. It wasn't the best that was ever conceived but it was better than The Wire's finale which is my favourite show ever. I give the finale a 9.99/10 but just because I wanted things to turn out differently doesn't mean the ending was horrible. There's such a thing as personal preference. My entire and small gripe with the ending is that I am just not a fan of redemption arcs when the creator of the show has stated on multiple occasions that he had no plans to do it. :lol:
     
  19. Tim

    Tim My perversion power is accumulating LPA Super Member

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    I don't buy that one bit. Walt may have had good intentions early on, but he let bitterness and resentment over his own failures in life cloud his judgement. Heisenberg is just a brand. Blaming the terrible things Walt did on some dubious split-personality disorder is just another way of attempting to absolve Walt of his guilt and make him seem like less of a reprehensible person than he really is. Sure, he wasn't completely devoid of humanity, but not every dangerous or violent person is a pure sociopath.
     
  20. Jesse

    Jesse Out of the abyss. LPA Über VIP

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    I agree with this. Even evil people love and do good things, it doesn't make them any less of a scumbag though.
     

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