Discussion in 'News' started by Louis, May 23, 2017.
"ALTWIRE's Derek: 'Stab Yourself In The Face' If You Think I Sold Out"
"The band can't live forever. We are in a turning point in our career."
You know how sometimes people say something that make you think "well, shit."? This was one of those things.
Anyway, i feel like LP has been "defending" this album ever since it was officially announced. I know this happens on every record they put out but i don't remember it ever being this bad with all the backlash. Hell, with all this negativity i can't help but feel like this album will get the ATS treatment over time. It probably won't get the same praise ATS gets, but in a couple of years when people finally understand this album it will be a complete 180 from now.
As a former writer for Altwire, I do agree that someone who has championed the band for so long should not have reviewed it. That being said, Altwire is Derek's site. Derek has championed the band for a long time. He has dialogue with LP's management constantly. The band know who he is. In other words, Derek has a right to write whatever the fuck he wants.
It's funny because I totally hate the album yet the very argument I just presented can be associated to LP's thought process for writing OML. It's ultimately their decision. Am I happy with it? No. Do I think they can do better? Yes. Do I believe that staying "relevent" entered the band members' minds during writing this album? Absolutely. This video pretty much confirms that.
Everything surrounding this album including the album itself has totally sucked balls to me. The promotion, the artwork, the attitude displayed by the band...I could go on. The band need to understand that this is a huge leap they're asking existing fans to take. It's the biggest change in direction they've ever taken. Even MTM and ATS sound like Linkin Park. OML to me sounds like a Timbaland album featuring Chester and Mike. It stinks of pop cliche and cheesy hooks. My general feeling is that if the band feel they have to go such lengths to defend their work, I have a right to tell them their work sucks. Something I think they'd respect in all honesty. I don't associate myself as a HT fanboy, I want the band to challenge themselves. I did not expect a pop record but there you go. The fact that we have this debate makes the band relevent unto itself as it makes them a topic of discussion.
Let's not forget though that even the late great Chris Cornell did a pop record with Timbaland. He will still always be remembered as one of the greatest rock n roll icons of all time.
Thank you. To play devil's advocate, I have a feeling that even if I had enlisted another writer to do the review...if the review was still very positive, many people would've claimed I influenced that in some way. Even though I never do so with any writer.
I will definitely say that some parts of this cycle were frustrating. I didn't always agree with the promotion and how it was handled, and I do feel in some cases it made the cycle itself less than enjoyable. This was probably one of the more stressful cycles we dealt with on LPA, but album artwork wise and music wise, I did enjoy it a lot. I'm hoping the promotion itself is less stressful next time around.
I gave this album a chance, listened to it and I struggled to finish. I just realized, I'm not a target for their new music since I don't listen to that whole rap-pop-edm music or whatever it is. That's why I hate this album and won't buy or listen to it again. LP is trying to find their way to teenagers hearts like they did in early 2000's, but I'm not a teenager anymore like I was when they became a worldwide sensation.
I just don't feel like they're trying to appeal to teenagers...they're old men in comparison to today's biggest hits. I mean...LP is OLD. What teenager gives a fuck about the way Mike feels when he and his kid are apart? Or Chesters youth? I mean...WE care about that stuff as part of the hardcore fan base, but younger people now don't. There are new, fresh, relevant artists for them to connect to in the same vein that we connected to LP when we were younger. From the lyrics, to artwork, to narrative and interviews, I honestly believe LP wanted to make this album. It's too personal to them for it to be a shameless cash grab.
I meant from music point of view, album is very attractive to teenage listener in 2017. It doesn't matter LP is older than typical pop idols. They did an album that can easily compete with everything what's popular in music right now. However, I don't think they will succeed in long term because pop music is already saturated and there isn't much space for them. Bad reviews won't help them either. At the same time, they've managed to alienate more fans with their mouthy rants.
Yeah, I guess I should clarify. I am in NO WAY trying to suggest that you somehow benefit monetarily from the relationship between LPA/AltWire/Linkin Park. I am not questioning your intentions or morals. I was afraid the post would come off insulting and I almost deleted it before posting.
But when I use the term "ethics," I'm talking about systematic structures. I used an example with Marlboro, I'll try a different example. Rolling Stone publishes a review of the new Coldplay album by Person A. Person A says the new Coldplay album is the best of the year. Come to find out, Person A has a long history of running a Coldplay fansite, and a semi-formal relationship with people who work directly for Coldplay.
Person A might be able to compartmentalize all this and write a 100% honest review of the new Coldplay album. Person A might very well honestly think it is the best of the year. The point is that, because of the way all these structures are put in place, no one can really know for sure (except Person A). Ethics and morality are different in that way. Ethical codes of conduct are put in place to avoid putting people like Person A in these awkward situations where they could be questioned in the first place.
Nothing I have ever seen from you has led me to believe you are an immoral person. Quite the opposite, actually. I cannot stress this enough. I'm really sorry if it came across as me accusing you of doing something immoral. I definitely don't believe that to be the case.
I honestly feel that if this album instrumentally was any genre other than pop, we wouldn't be having these discussions. Lyrically the album is one of their best, and some of these songs are written well. I strongly feel that if this album changed genres, there wouldn't be so much hate and bias against it.
This is definitely better explained and I appreciate it, but I'll put it on the record for anyone who doubts: I 100% compartmentalize on every Linkin Park review. If I hated this record, and it made me want to vomit, I would've not held that back whatsoever. If Linkin Park ever makes an "F" album (which I strongly feel this album is not), it's going to be stated as such. I may hurt the band if I do that, but so be it. My opinions aren't for sale, and that's the point I was trying to make.
I'm glad that's not what you meant though. Thank you.
So then, in YOUR opinion, why IS this the instrumental choice LP went with for such a personal album? Do you lean more towards LP being passionate about this particular sound, or do you think there's a lot of merit to them intentionally taking a personal record and putting pop elements in for the sake of sales? I'm curious about your opinion.
Mike can't be so naive as to think LP can put out a pop sounding album like this 17 years into their career and have it be some mega-truning point, can be? Surely this must be a direction they honestly wanted to go? I mean look at those studio update emails from years back. The entire theme was honesty and vulnerability. I wholeheartedly believe that's the record they wanted to make.
Honestly, I think it's just the way the songs progressed. They started out writing the songs on just piano and guitar, and then built the songs up after they had already written the lyrics and melodies. I think this is just what came out .
I would agree with that. It's why it makes me understand the way Chester has reacted to criticisms of selling out. What a bullshit, slap in the face of something you put out that's honest and personal to you.
The criticisms of this album are even getting to ME for a change, and I usually disregard them every album cycle.
Try having your integrity questioned because you like an album.
So if I wasn't a pretty big fan of Starset, I shouldn't have reviewed their latest album Vessels and I shouldn't have given it an "A" rating because of some preconceived bias and because of that my "journalistic integrity" is completely invalid? As I stand with Derek, I can say that I reviewed the album and acted accordingly. In my case, I really understood and dug what that particular band was going after; much like Derek did with his review for Linkin Park. I tend to review music that I like, usually from bands that I like because I wouldn't want to torture myself writing out a review for something I didn't care for. Derek is the same way. If Derek felt like he was going to give an album an unfair review for some preconceived notion, he would have enlisted someone else to do that review. It is completely unfair to say that it wasn't his "A" to give. Let me ask you where your music review website that you started is? I'll wait. Also, way to go on COMPLETELY derailing this thread with your bullshit accusations.
Lol an extremely good point. It's why I haven't bothered to craft any sort of song by song breakdown myself. Your review was more than fine. Very professionally written.
Oh well. Years down the road none of this will matter when we're still enjoying the album.
I think LP should go on a long hiatus, you know like they kinda did between Meteora and MTM but even longer. And come back and do a reunion tour
Fuck Linkin Park! all I want is a Mike Shinoda solo album
I literally signed up just to chime in on this. Totally agree. I've loved LP forever and browsed here for years and this is easily the worst album they've made. This site seems to be unable to see outside the box and judging by some statements by multiple members over the years clearly haven't branched out in music.
Derek seems cool, but an A may be the funniest thing I've seen given to this album (besides that 98 from one site). The reviews are overwhelmingly bad because this simply isn't a good album. It may be personal to the band, it may even be "fun" to hear once. But after a few listens I struggle to even continue it. It's not due to pop, it's simply the most generic, bland album they could've possibly put out.
And the criticism is clearly somewhat true or else the band wouldn't be lashing back at fans in such a manner, the truth can hurt. It's rather pathetic tbh. This is the first album I didn't buy from them, I hope it's the last time that happens.
LP has typically stood out and tried new things, but this album could easily be confused with plenty of other artists on top 40 radio. Even Mike's rap verse is weak, which is rare.
I'm glad LP did what they wanted, but fans have every right to criticize when disappointed, happens all the time to every artist, most just know how to deal with it without acting like a child.
Hell I'm a huge Kanye fan, even he acts out at times, but rarely over music. And Yeezus was much more polarizing and on a bigger scale than LP. That's true "experimentation".
Separate names with a comma.