Why do most people dislike Meteora?

Discussion in 'Linkin Park Chat' started by limonpower, Jun 13, 2014.

  1. #1
    limonpower

    limonpower Well-Known Member

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    I've seen a lot of hate on Meteora over the years, and I was wondering why people don't like it. I feel it is their best album to date. (I haven't listened to all of THP yet, but it still doesn't seem like it'll be as good)
     
  2. #2
    Susy

    Susy god break down the door LPA Contributor

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    inb4 ''What's a Meteora?''
     
  3. #3
    MagmaXtreme

    MagmaXtreme Well-Known Member

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    Personally Meteora is my favourite album, mainly because I really like the soft nu-metal vibe it has and I can relate to the songs on a lyrical level. If you look at the demos made from that era you can see that this album had so much more potential, the unreleased meteora project, Cumulus and Halo especially show some real variety and interesting sounds in there.

    However in saying that, on an objective level I understand why this is possibly LP's weakest album, why? Because it has too many weak songs.


    First of all, the lyrics had to be forced in to the instrumentals, that's how the band wrote their music at the time, and after having done such with HT that process imo really hindered the lyrical quality of some songs on there. This is especially evident with songs like Somewhere I Belong and From The Inside.


    Secondly, if you compare the songs together you find that many of them are not very different from each other in terms of structure, lyrical patterns etc. Compare Lyring From You, Easier To Run, Breaking The Habit for a test, what makes each track stand out from the rest? Not much really. And songs like Hit The Floor (One of my favourite LP songs because of it's lyrical aggressiveness) just lack in the instrumentation and feel sub-par in that aspect.

    I could go on and on for each song and criticize each one, but the point is Meteora has a lot of flaws when it comes to diversity, technical display, maintaining momentum (with some songs), and lyrical content (some songs just don't cut it so well and many seem to be about the same thing). This I imagine is why people dislike Meteora now, unless they're just like "Meteora is HT part 2 but HT is much better so screw Meteora...."
     
  4. #4
    Shadow

    Shadow The Evil That Men Do.. LPA VIP

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    If Hybrid Theory didn't exist and "In The End" had gotten swallowed by some blackhole where time and space didn't matter..

    Then perhaps "Meteora" would've gotten the praise it deserves.

    Sadly, that's not the case. In The End exist very fond in our hearts. Meteora is In The End multiplied by 12. #end
     
  5. #5
    limonpower

    limonpower Well-Known Member

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    Thank you guys for you feedback. You guys had very valid points!
    @Magma I thought most music was written by fitting lyrics to instrumentation :eek: That's how I've always done it anyway except my stuff is NO example for it being a good method XD
     
  6. #6
    MagmaXtreme

    MagmaXtreme Well-Known Member

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    The band talked about how when they did in their early days they were pretty much writing the same way rappers and MCs do, lay down an instrumental and put the lyrics on top.

    When they began making MTM, they found out, with guidance from Rick Rubin, that this method limited the potential of what songs they could make. One key issue was that some instrumentals would sound really good but would not work as a song, they were just good melodies.

    Take a look at some of the demos LP made like Homecoming and Basquiat from the MTM era, they're very nice tracks but I'm guessing they just didn't work as songs and so did not end up on the studio album.

    Anyway their improved method which they still use to this day which is to do the vocals and instrumentals together from early on i.e. they would hum words etc with the tracks they make to see if they work as songs. This has sometimes been reffered to by members of the band as doing 'scats', see one example of that here:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=euZ1wZERdpQ

    It makes sense to start out trying to make the music good first and worry about lyrics later, because it is important to improve those tune-crafting skills :)

    Do you have your music posted somewhere online btw? I like to see what LP fans come with creatively in their music :D
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2014
  7. #7
    limonpower

    limonpower Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the info! Tbh I haven't really recorded much of my music, I plan to get to that eventually lol. I do however have one random electronic song I made on my bandcamp. http://shinigamimachine.bandcamp.com/releases
     
  8. #8
    minuteforce

    minuteforce Danny's not here, Mrs. Torrance. LPA Team

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    The band have indeed talked about this, but it isn't particularly evident on the album itself, in my opinion. I don't think that there's any point in any of the songs where you can point to it and say "see, it's obvious that they forced the melody in here"
     
  9. #9
    Robot Man

    Robot Man Well-Known Member

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    Because it's a carbon copy of Hybrid Theory, in the worst kind of way.
     
  10. #10
    Sonic

    Sonic Searching for the last Chaos Emerald... LPA Super Member

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    Musically, it's pretty good. My personal distaste of the album is because it lacks creativity as it really just sounds like a carbon copy of Hybrid Theory. Songs sounds the same, are structured the same, and are, for the most part, in the same order. Most fans get excited to see the 2nd-to-last track be an instrumental, or at least hope for it. That's not okay. At the time it came out, that was okay, but since the 4 albums after it, Meteora just seems dull.

    My biggest reason though is all the cheesy lyrics and overproduction. Look at everyone bitching about how Chester sounds on The Hunting Party, even though that's actually his natural voice. He just sounds so fake on Meteora and even Hybrid Theory.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2014
  11. #11
    Derek

    Derek LPAssociation.com Administrator LPA Administrator

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    To me it's the above, followed by the later realization that the album's demos are far more interesting than the final product. And it's not that lyrics couldn't fit over the tracks. For Cumulus I did an experiment and laid Lost In The Echo's acapella over it perfectly...lyrics CAN work on those tracks, and they can work well. It's just for some reason, likely due to Don Gilmore...they decided to re-write bad songs and discard truly good songs. They spent time rewriting the most generic tracks, with the most generic lyrics instead of focusing on fine tuning the best demos. Like Magma said...the songs share the same song structures (with some even resembling tracks on HT) and they don't offer much to seperate themselves from eachother musically. THP on the other hand, is an example of the band doing a 'hard sound' but musically diversifying over the course of an entire album. Sure there are similarities to other songs on the album, but the album still manages to keep things unique and interesting over 45 minutes, which Meteora struggles to do in 37 minutes. Meteora has catchy songs, but as evidenced by the demos...it left some of it's most creative moments on the cutting room floor.
     
  12. #12
    hawk

    hawk because the internet LPA Super VIP

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    because if you don't hate it you get flamed here. simple.
     
  13. #13
    Derek

    Derek LPAssociation.com Administrator LPA Administrator

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    Not true and it'd be nice if you didn't help spread misconceptions about the site. There's plenty of people who appreciate Meteora, and who are allowed to appreciate it without being criticized. The people who DO get criticized, are the people who absolutely refuse to let the band evolve and feel that they should've kept on trying to rewrite Hybrid Theory for the rest of their lives. The people who demand they return to Gilmore instead of creating the music they WANT to make. Those are the people who the community here generally has a problem with.
     
  14. #14
    AkirraKrylon

    AkirraKrylon LPA VIP LPA VIP

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    I appreciate Meteora for the simple fact that I feel it was a "necessary" (and I use that term loosely) follow up to Hybrid Theory that solidified the band's staying power in the rock world. Had the band wrote MTM or ATS to follow up Hybrid Theory, would they be in the position they are today? I'm not so sure...

    Other than that I enjoy Meteora from time to time, especially for the energy it brings to the live set. Although the guitar work on the album is nothing spectacular or mind boggling, the music overall is catchy and very "Linkin Park" sounding.

    Are the lyrics the greatest the band has ever written? Not even close...definitely the worst actually. But it still holds a special place for me because it was such a huge album for me growing up. I recognize from a musical aspect that it's really just a re-do of the previous album.

    Call it nostalgia, call it whatever but I still think Meteora has value in some shape or form.
     
  15. #15
    minuteforce

    minuteforce Danny's not here, Mrs. Torrance. LPA Team

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    I definitely agree that "Meteora" was definitely important for the band in that it proved to naysayers that "Hybrid Theory" wasn't a fluke. The album also saw the band experiment a little, resulting in tracks such as "Breaking The Habit" and "Session", the former of which is said to have paved the way for the proper stylistic departure on the band's third album.
     
  16. #16
    Derek

    Derek LPAssociation.com Administrator LPA Administrator

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    I definitely respect Meteora for what it did (guaranteed that the band would have staying power to make the music they WANTED to make), but I also feel it brought forth an unsavory part of the fanbase...that criticizes the band's efforts to innovate, and attempts to force them into making uninspired repeats of their older music. It's why I feel Meteora was both a blessing and a curse for this band, and why we'll always have 'bring back the nu-metal' idiots in this fanbase.
     
  17. #17
    Atticus

    Atticus Bullets lance the bravest lungs

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    The hate users get for liking Meteora on the LPA is just plain disrespectful and rude. I've seen people outright laughed at and ridiculed for having a different opinion. It's the weakest Linkin Park album in my opinion but I'm not about to stoop to levels where I insult others for that reason.

    I don't exactly "dislike" Meteora. Contrary to the beaten dead-horse joke, the album is in fact better than a steaming pile of shit. The problem with it however is the identity issues it struggles with. Meteora wants to be a 2nd Hybrid Theory so badly that it feels like melodies were ripped directly from Hybrid Theory, lyrics were changed, and then recreated on Meteora. For example, Don't Stay sounds far too similar to One Step Closer and Pushing Me Away sounds just like Numb. This makes it seem as though the band lost all inspiration with this album, but that's clearly not the case as we have early Meteora demos that sound infinitely different. And then there's the case of the lyrical content which is mostly cringeworthy, although I'm usually able to look past them and listen to the music for what it is. On the plus side, the album did give us songs that are superior to most of Hybrid Theory such as "Faint", "Lying From You", and "Breaking The Habit". It's just unfortunate that the rest of the album wasn't as inspired.
     
  18. #18
    Derek

    Derek LPAssociation.com Administrator LPA Administrator

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    The problem is that it was a completely critic driven album. They didn't make it because they were creating a sound they themselves wanted to make, they did it because they felt the need to prove to people they weren't a fluke. That they could capitalize on the success of Hybrid Theory and continue to craft successful rock songs. They said this during interviews at the time, and have since called Meteora 'Hybrid Theory Part 2' meaning they acknowledge this album was intended to be a copy of the first record. What bothers me about that, and I think why I dislike the album so much is I can't understand WHY that was done. Why would a band who founded themselves on the idea of creating a style of music that currently 'didn't exist' on rock radio, paint themselves into a corner or doom themselves into a lifetime of being compared to their past, by repeating a sound? By consigning the same exact sound to two seperate albums, it made the transition from Meteora to MTM all the more jarring, and difficult for the public to understand. Had they changed their sound from the getgo, such experimentation would've been expected and they wouldn't have spent three albums running away from what people expected of them. I feel Meteora as a whole was a mistake. A wrong step in an otherwise mostly excellent career and discography.
     
  19. #19
    Francois Dillinger

    Francois Dillinger Well-Known Member

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    But I like Meteora. :awesome:

    I've seen most people here and on other LP sites -and that being since 2006 that I've been lurking/posting on LP forums- disliking Meteora for many reasons. Before M2M came out, most people that complained about it were doing it because they thought it was a softer and way watered down Hybrid Theory, then after the albums that followed I see many blaming it mostly for the ultimate abuse of what is (was) known as the Linkin Park songwriting formula, for the cheesy lyrics and the many similarities with Hybrid Theory.

    To me, Meteora has always sounded like a record that has a special "vibe", and that is mainly because of its production. It certainly is overproduced, but this production choice, at that point with Linkin Park, made the songs actually sound different than the usual "big" sounding poppy productions that you get then and now. I don't like Don Gilmore generally as a producer, his stuff after LP are mediocre, but with Linkin Park at that time, his work fit pretty well.

    Music,lyrics and songwritting-wise, the album is surely really similar to Hybrid Theory. Basic structure, basic Linkin Park songwritting, same teenage-angst generic lyrics that are as much of a "problem" as they are on Hybrid Theory. Back in the day, I had no interest or experience with experimental sounds, weird structures, musical landscapes etc, so I didnt really care about all that. Nowadays, after 10 years of listening to so much and different music, I see those flaws, but then again I think it's wrong to go as far as "Meteora is crap" because the songs are formulaic or because it sounds like HT.

    To sum it up, I really dig Meteora and what I mostly like about it now is the dark and futuristic vibe that it gives out to me, like a more depressing and atmospherically heavier Hybrid Theory. And I believe that, if we judge it for what it is, and that is Linkin Park's second album after a HUGE and unexpectedly succesful debut, that turned them big overnight, it is far from crap. Not many bands can repeat their sound in a way that doesnt lower their standards, and with Meteora LP managed to maintain theirs on the same level.
     
  20. #20
    Kaique Smart

    Kaique Smart There's nothing to fear but fear itself

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    Hybrid Theory Part 2
     

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